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 | | RE: ALL ORV ACCESS IS CLOSED |  |
Posted By: salvo (2463 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 8:39 AM |
OBX Area: Salvo
Home: cleveland, oh |
What!? Everywhere and everything!? Where did this come from?
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| | Clarification of ORV closing(s) |  |
Posted By: dennis in FBG-VA/KDH (944 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 9:20 AM |
OBX Area: Kill Devil Hills
Home: FBG-VA/KDH-NC, va |
This is the official NPS web site explaining the closure at Bodie Island spit....
http://www.nps.gov/caha/parknews/access-status-at-bodie-island-spit.htm
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| | Ginny here: Get the facts |  |
Posted By: Jim and Ginny (752 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 11:56 AM |
OBX Area: Buxton
Home: Buxton, NC |
Judges Ruling and NPS response
http://capehatterasanglersclub.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=96&Itemid=2
I seem to recall someone said no one ever proposed closing all of CHNSRA beaches 
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| | RE: ALL ORV ACCESS IS CLOSED |  |
Posted By: ALs (1503 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 9:18 AM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: Gainesville, VA |
Do you recall the story of Pinnochio???
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| | RE: ALL ORV ACCESS IS CLOSED |  |
Posted By: Budman (711 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 9:28 AM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: Linden, VA |
Read it for yourself
IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF NORTH CAROLINA
NORTHERN DIVISION
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, )
)
v. )
)
VASILE MATEI, )
)
Defendant. )
O R D E R
This case was tried before the undersigned as a criminal trial on July 16,2007, at the
regular criminal term of United States District Court at Elizabeth city; North Carolina. The
Defendant, a resident of Virginia, was charged with operating a vehicle without due care on the
Cape Hatteras National Seashore ("CAHA").
The alleged violation occurred on the afternoon of May 27,2007, a Sunday, and the midholiday
day of the Memorial Day weekend. Testimony at trial included that of a United States
Park Ranger, on duty at the time and location of the violation. The testimony established that
there was traffic on a narrow strip of sand extending from the ramp in the vicinity of the Oregon
Inlet Fishing Center, south and east along the oceanfront beach in the direction of Oregon Inlet,
which is an open body of water connecting the Atlantic Ocean with the Albemarle, Parnlico,
Croatan, and Currituck Sounds, through a tidal inlet. The area, consisting of sand dune and tidal
beach, is characterized by a narrow passage along the beach south of the entry ramp and an
expanding area of accreted sand. Since the construction of the high rise bridge on Highway 12
across Oregon Inlet linking the south end of Bodie Island with the north end of Pea Island, the
Case 2:07-mj-01075-BO Document 2 Filed 07/17/2007 Page 1 of 4
areas had developed irregularly. All of the land on the south side of Bodie Island is within the
National Seashore.
This particular area is characterized as a fragile transitional over-wash area, which has
historically been a valuable and declining resource for endangered shorebirds and turtles. In
recent seasons, there have been extensive bird enclosure areas located throughout this area, and
turtle nesting has traditionally taken place in this area. See generally, NATIONAPLA RKS ERVICE,
PIPINGP LOVER(C HARADRIUMSE LODUSM) ONITORINAGT CAPEH ATTERANSA TIONAL
SEASHOR2E0,0 6 ANNUALR EPORT( 2006), available at: http://www.nps.gov/cahdnaturescience/
upload/2006%20PIPL%20Fina1%2OReport-2.pdf [hereinafter PIPINGP LOVERA NNUALR EPORT];
NATIONAPLA RKS ERVICEC,A PEH ATTERANSA TIONASLE ASHOR2E0 06 SEAT URTLEA NNUAL
REPORT (2006), available at: http://www.nps.gov/caha~naturescience/upload/
2006%20Sea%20Turtle%20Fina1%20Report.pdf [hereinafter SEAT URTLEA NNUALR EPORT].
The testimony at trial established that United States Department of Interior pilots with the
Park Service made an overflight on May 27 and counted approximately 1,200 vehicles located in
the over-wash area. Because camping overnight is prohibited, all of the traffic was in transit at
some point on the date of the violation. The Court takes judicial notice that at a minimum one
occupant per vehicle was at the scene. Further, it is reasonably expected that there were two or
more persons per vehicle in such a recreational setting, making between 2,500 and 5,000 people
a reasonable estimate of the number of people crowded onto this narrow, fragile, environmentally
sensitive area on the Sunday of Memorial Day weekend.
On the date and time of the violation, Defendant attempted to drive a large four-wheel
drive vehicle off the beach and into an area adjacent to the dunes, ultimately intending to exit on
Case 2:07-mj-01075-BO Document 2 Filed 07/17/2007 Page 2 of 4
the ramp. Because of the high volume of traffic resulting in degradation of the beach, there were
deep ruts in the sand, some being feet in depth. Operating a vehicle in these conditions, only feet
from with sun bathers, families and children on the beach creates a serious hazard for injury or
death. The evidence at trial demonstrated that Defendant drove at a speed dangerous for
conditions, traveling in an erratic and serpentine manner through the ruts in the sand causing
spray of sand and danger to people on the beach. Defendant was cited for this behavior failing to
drive with due care. After a hearing the evidence, the Court found beyond a reasonable doubt
that the violation had been established.
By executive order, President Nixon required that the Department of the Interior publish
regulations defining specific trails and areas for the use of off-road vehicles "(ORV"). Exec.
Order No. 11,644,37 C.F.R. 5 2877 (1972), as amended by Exec. Order No. 11,898,42 Fed.
Reg. 26,959 (May 24,2977). The regulations to designate which areas are open to ORV traffic
must promote safety for all users, minimize damage to public lands and wildlife, and take into
consideration endangered or threatened species. 43 C.F.R 5 8342.1, The designation process
must include public participation, and include local landowners and other interested parties. Id. 5
8342.2. Once a plan is approved, areas and trails must be clearly identified so that the public will
be aware of the applicable limitations. Id Operating a motor vehicle is prohibited except where
the Park Service has specifically designated that ORV use is permitted, in accordance with the
aforementioned regulations. 30 C.F.R. 4 4.10; 1 8 U.S.C. 5 357 1. Thus, where the Park Service
fails to create a plan for ORV use, ORV is prohibited.
CAHA does not have regulations in place to govern ORV traffic. Consequently, it is also
a violation to operate a motor vehicle on Cape Hatteras National Seashore without prior authority
Case 2:07-mj-01075-BO Document 2 Filed 07/17/2007 Page 3 of 4
and is punishable by up to $5,000.00, six months in prison, or both. 18 U.S.C. ยง 3571. By
permitting unregulated ORV traffic on CAHA, Defendant and others come dangerously close to
accidents with pedestrians including children. Indeed, ORV traffic directly impacts attempts to
protect endangered species from human encroachment. From April 1 to August 3 1, 2006, the
Park Service recorded 47 ORV violations of barricaded closures for bird nesting areas. PIPING
PLOVERA NNUARLE PORT9 . AS the home to five species of sea turtles, two of which are
threatened and three of which are endangered, 23 ORV violations of sea turtle closed areas were
recorded in the 2006 season. SEAT URTLEA NNUARLE PORT1 1 -12 . Although the impact of ORV
traffic on endangered species and risk to pedestrians is yet unmeasured, without an ORV plan in
place, the Park Service is without the manpower to enforce many of the rules in place on heavily
trafficked days like that of the date of violation. Accordingly, it is a violation to operate an ORV
on CAHA without authority from the Department of the Interior or its designee, and Defendant
must pay $1 00 fine and special assessment.
SO ORDERED, this 1 7 day of July, 2007.
&RRENCE W. BOYLE
UNITED STATES
Case 2:07-mj-01075-BO Document 2 Filed 07/17/2007 Page 4 of 4
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| | RE: ALL ORV ACCESS IS CLOSED |  |
Posted By: mah (644 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 9:29 AM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: Blacksburg, VA |
I do not understand why no one has read that the judge has closed all of CHNSRA
If anyone would take time to look at the link Budman posted on the main page to Red Drum tackle it shows the judges ruling. So please stop with this crap.
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| | RE: ALL ORV ACCESS IS CLOSED | |
Posted By: salvo (2463 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 9:59 AM |
OBX Area: Salvo
Home: cleveland, oh |
Does anyone know anything about this Vasile Matei? The document lists him as the defendant. I am all for ORV access...without a doubt...but it is people like him who ruin things for everyone else. Is he the reason for this judgement? And he only received a $100 fine? This is nuts!!!
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| | RE: ALL ORV ACCESS IS CLOSED | |
Posted By: Budman (711 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 10:29 AM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: Linden, VA |
May have been a plant. How does a Nixon ruling come up for a traffic violation?
Something is fishy and it isn't my bait.
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| | RE: ALL ORV ACCESS IS CLOSED |  |
Posted By: SandyBottom (273 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 10:35 AM |
OBX Area: Corolla
Home: Alexandria, VA |
Hey, if they just fined everyone who was there that weekend, we could replace the Bonner Bridge free of charge.
5000 fines X $5000 = $25,000,000 Woohoo!
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| | RE: ALL ORV ACCESS IS CLOSED |  |
Posted By: Renee (6061 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 10:44 AM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: TooFarWest, NC |
I posted a copy of what I'm using to send to my elected officials over on the main page.
Please people..investigate before you type. Budman is correct!!! The full cosure is supposed to take effect tomorrow morning if something isn't done to overrule this. The only hope we have is that ther IS an approved Interim Stragy now in effect whioch wasn't when this offense occured in May. However..the strategy was in effect when the judge made the ruling.
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| | I went to the source! | |
Posted By: dennis in FBG-VA/KDH (944 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 10:55 AM |
OBX Area: Kill Devil Hills
Home: FBG-VA/KDH-NC, va |
Wednesday, 10:45 am...I just got off the phone with Cindy of the Supt office for the National Park Service at CHNS. She advised me that the only closure(s) are the one listed for the plover which are posted on the NPS website. NOT all of the CHNS is closed to ORV.
Should u want verification call:
252-473-2111 and after the prompts should u wish to talk to someone personally it will give you that option....
I depend on the NPS for the official information in regards to beach closings may I suggest everyone involved do the same.....now I am off to the beach, may I suggest y'all do the same!
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| | RE: I went to the source! | |
Posted By: mah (644 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 11:06 AM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: Blacksburg, VA |
I called also and for now the beaches are open but they can not tell me how the judges ruling will affect access after today. The NPS is looking into all aspects of what she called the judges vague ruling.
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| | thank you | |
Posted By: dennis in FBG-VA/KDH (944 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 11:13 AM |
OBX Area: Kill Devil Hills
Home: FBG-VA/KDH-NC, va |
THANK YOU...for getting information from the source (NPS)....I believe it is important not to feed the frenzy which leads to confusion and mis-information...As they always have, the National Park Service will issue statements when developments occur to closures.
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| | RE: thank you | |
Posted By: Renee (6061 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 11:31 AM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: TooFarWest, NC |
My information comes form "the source" also. This email is from Mike Murray.
To Elected Officials, Negotiated Rulemaking Participants, and Media
Contacts:
Late yesterday the park received the following court order from U.S.
District Court Judge Terrence W. Boyle. NPS will consult with DOI and DOJ
attorneys today to determine how to respond. We will share additional
information when it is available.
(See attached file: Vasile Matei order.pdf)
Mike Murray
Superintendent
Cape Hatteras NS/ Wright Brothers NMem/ Ft. Raleigh NHS
They do have the court order, the court order. The court order does say that driving on the beaches is illegal. The closures are not in effect yet. But they very well may be soon.
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| | Ginny here: Yes, wait | |
Posted By: Jim and Ginny (752 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 12:05 PM |
OBX Area: Buxton
Home: Buxton, NC |
don't make any calls, don't write any letters, don't do anything until the beaches are closed. Then during the months it takes to reverse the closures, watch Hatteras and Ocracoke Island businesses fail one by one.
At least there will be less crowds.
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| | RE: Ginny here: Yes, wait |  |
Posted By: OBXSeaQueen (59 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 12:15 PM |
OBX Area: Ocracoke
Home: Wilmington, DE |
Ginny this doesnt matter to him as he is above the bridge. I have fired off my letters this morning and my hubby who is a member of the CHAC will do his when he gets home from work. I have family and friends who live down on Ocracoke and it scares me to see what will happen to their businesses if this nonsense holds up. I want to know if I can get my money back we have paid for our licenses to fish? Maybe I should sue too, it makes as much sense as this ruling...
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| | RE: thank you |  |
Posted By: tiberiuspop (619 posts)
Date Posted: 7/19/2007 10:21 AM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: ORV on the Beaches of, NC |
actually, NPS is not the source - the judges order is. If you can believe the government agency - NPS - they were completely blindsided by this also.
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| | Ginny here: Yes | |
Posted By: Jim and Ginny (752 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 12:01 PM |
OBX Area: Buxton
Home: Buxton, NC |
go to the beach now, you may or may not have the privialge tomorrow.
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| | the drama, the drama, the drama | |
Posted By: dennis in FBG-VA/KDH (944 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 4:38 PM |
OBX Area: Kill Devil Hills
Home: FBG-VA/KDH-NC, va |
My initial post and subsequent posts were to try and advise everyone who was interested in what the PRESENT status of the closure(s). No one can predict what the future may bring as to the closures, but I can assure that the RDT message board would not be my source of information on closures.
MAH wants me to stop the "crap"...The crap I posted was the official link of the NPS and only quoted NPS sources.
Jim and Ginny here are issuing their usual doom and gloom and worst case scenario.
OBXseaqueen has the nerve to say that I dont care because I am North of the bridge...Maybe the maps up in Wilimington, Delaware are differnet than mine, but the CURRENT closing of the Bodie Island spit is ABOVE the Bonner bridge. That kind of mentality of the northern beaches vs the southern beaches just doesn't hold water and I wish some would stop trying to spread that hype.
The fact of the matter is that I care very much about the closures (I would venture to guess that I use the area much more than many of you) and hope that the entire closure of CHNS does not ever occur; however I will not succumb to the hysteria in some of these posts.
The NPS is and will continue to be my source of information in regard to any beach closures and if there is no objection from Will, I will continue to post information released from the NPS which I feel will benefit the members of this board.
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| | RE: the drama, the drama, the drama | |
Posted By: mah (644 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 4:45 PM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: Blacksburg, VA |
My response was directed to Als and to the fact that this judges ruling did happen. What the outcome will be should soon be known.
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| | RE: May not be enforced yet | |
Posted By: salvo (2463 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 12:33 PM |
OBX Area: Salvo
Home: cleveland, oh |
I have emailed my two Senators and to my congressman. With some modifications, I used Renee's template. I appreciate the information provided on this site over the past few months so that I could make an informed decision on the situation. With all due respect, Dennis, I cannot, any longer, blindly put my faith in any government organization or agency. Without opening up a whole other can of worms...I guess I am very tired of the lies....on many levels and involving many issues. I feel my trust, and in some ways my votes, have been violated over and over again. So to all of you ORV people who responsibley visit the Cape Hatteras National Seashore and enjoy the beauty, the fishing, the shells, the birds, etc...I hope my letters have some impact, however small. I hope to be able to drive out to the Point on our next visit. And Dennis, once again, all due respect. I am not trying to start a rant or a war.
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| | RE: May not be enforced yet | |
Posted By: Renee (6061 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 12:55 PM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: TooFarWest, NC |
I fully respect the NPS and realize that they were as blinsided by this ruling as we all were. They are trying to make sense of this and I feel that Mike Murray will do eerything in his power to keep the beaches open if possible. The "if possible" is the biggie in this deal. And they will continue to tell you , whenyou call, that the beaches are open today because they are! But if the people and groups opposed to these closures are not successful,,they won't be open for long. None of us is sure when this full closure will take place, but MAKE NO MISTAKE- it will happen sometime soon if something isn't done to overturn this ruling.
What in the world do you think is going on in this Judge's head right now? Do you think that he even cares that a ruling he made last night could ruin the lives and businesses of thousand of Dare County residents? After all, he isn't from Dare County.
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| | Renee |  |
Posted By: Shelly (1300 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 1:05 PM |
OBX Area: Frisco
Home: Greensburg, PA |
If you here anything more today, please try to post it on this board if you have time. The filters that they have on our computers here at work do not allow me to access RDT or Rob's board.
Thanks!
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| | Just to add to Renee's post | |
Posted By: OBXSeaQueen (59 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 3:05 PM |
OBX Area: Ocracoke
Home: Wilmington, DE |
Ocracoke is in Hyde County not Dare but as Hyde County's main revenue producer I hope that those officials are taking notice. Just think, the #1 beach in the USA and you can no longer drive on the beach there.
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| | RE: Just to add to Renee's post | |
Posted By: Renee (6061 posts)
Date Posted: 7/18/2007 4:17 PM |
OBX Area: Hatteras
Home: TooFarWest, NC |
I hate to tell you this, but I think (the way I read it) that the order will apply to ALL of the Cape Hatteras National Seashore, including Ocracoke.
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| | Ginny Here:Beaches are open but for how long? | |
Posted By: Jim and Ginny (752 posts)
Date Posted: 7/19/2007 9:57 AM |
OBX Area: Buxton
Home: Buxton, NC |
DOW Attorney and reg. neg. representative, Jason Rylander's comments are presented below. Another demonstration of DOW intent to work toward a real compromise on ORV use? Oh, I forgot someone once said they didn't know anyone who proposed closing all CHNSRA beaches to ORVs.
Jason Rylander of the Defenders of Wildlife, an environmental group, said Wednesday his group believes the superintendent has no choice but to close the beaches to off-road vehicles until a management plan is in place.
"Our position is that the units of the National Park Service should follow the law," he said. "If they wanted to avoid this situation, they should have had a management plan."
Defenders of Wildlife, among other groups, have threatened to sue the park over its lack of a plan. When asked Wednesday whether his group planned to file for an injunction, a move that could immediately stop off-road vehicle use in the park, Rylander declined to comment.
"I think the order really speaks for itself as to the law," he said. "I think it's really up to the Park Service whether it's going to follow the law as stated by the judge."
http://content.hamptonroads.com/story.cfm?story=128672&ran=4797
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