Any thoughts?

As for myself I think the meetings gave everyone an opportunity to discuss their thoughts on ORV management at CHNS and the items up for discussion by the NPS.

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I have one question which I did just brief research on. According to Wikipedia the AMOY is listed as LC (Least Concern, the bottomost categorization of status). Wikipedia also goes on to say that the AMOY is NOT protected under the ESA.
Is this correct? Isn't this the chick that now is causing the point to be closed?

I'm not looking for an argument, but wondered if the above info is true, then why is the point closed? Is there other information that negates this, or makes it invalid, or incorrect?

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It is one the State's list of birds of concern. The NPS defers to that list, however, does not use the state recommendation for smaller buffers.
This scoping was in regards to beach access hours, beach access seasons, permit fees and duration structure, vfas, improved accesses.
It was, like other meetings conducted by Super Hallac, well organized, but in the case of the KDH meeting, poorly attended. The majority of attendees at the KDH meeting were NPS employees and NCBBA members. I didn't count the number but I don't think it reached 30.

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I think that is because VFAs are not an issue, other than to a handful of mobile fishermen that want ORV access to all the Park beaches during the winter and shoulder seasons, The issue is access to Cape Point during nesting season and nighttime driving,

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I think that is because VFAs are not an issue, other than to a handful of mobile fishermen that want ORV access to all the Park beaches during the winter and shoulder seasons, The issue is access to Cape Point during nesting season and nighttime driving,

Do you remember how many shell collectors used to drive out on south beach at the Point looking to bolster their collection? Do you remember how many surfers used to drive out on south beach at the Point to ride waves on either side? Do you remember how many families used to drive out on south beach at the Point so their little ones could swim in the ocean where the waves were smaller? Do you remember how many people used to drive out on south beach at the Point to launch their small boats?
In addition to being a fisherman, I've also been one of the aforementioned groups but now the south beach is a vehicle free area. The stretch of beach between the Point and the open area of ramp 49 is virtually unused by people now. And apparently by the birds as well.

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It is a VFA not prohibited to people unless birds are nesting there just like everywhere else. Soon there will easier access to either end of it via the Inter dunal road. It will enhance all those rec activities should visitors choose from to walk there from their parked vehicle on the beach. It was picked to be a VFA because of the primitive wilderness nature of that beach. Appreciate it for that reason, enjoy the recreational opportunities that can still be enjoyed there.

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Sooooo in other words do what "they" think is the best usage for the beach, not what folks have done for decades which resulted in similar amounts of birds and turtles being hatched and fledged on the same beaches.

I have a problem with that mainly because I tend to march to my own drum beat but in addition when things don't improve then what's the point.

I attened the meeting in Hampton last night and there was 35-40 folks there of which all seemed to be pro-access which is strange because it was open to all, including the non-access folks. It makes you wonder why there were no "birders" there, maybe they already have what they want and don't feel the need to fight for any more "rights"

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It is a VFA not prohibited to people unless birds are nesting there just like everywhere else. Soon there will easier access to either end of it via the Inter dunal road. It will enhance all those rec activities should visitors choose from to walk there from their parked vehicle on the beach. It was picked to be a VFA because of the primitive wilderness nature of that beach. Appreciate it for that reason, enjoy the recreational opportunities that can still be enjoyed there.

You left the word "Few" out of your last sentence.
It should read: " Enjoy the few recreational activities that can still be enjoyed there."

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I had no idea that a state listed bird would be accorded a federal degree of protection when it is not covered under the ESA. Anyway, thanks for the insight.

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I have one question which I did just brief research on. According to Wikipedia the AMOY is listed as LC (Least Concern, the bottomost categorization of status). Wikipedia also goes on to say that the AMOY is NOT protected under the ESA.
Is this correct? Isn't this the chick that now is causing the point to be closed?

I'm not looking for an argument, but wondered if the above info is true, then why is the point closed? Is there other information that negates this, or makes it invalid, or incorrect?

"NOT listed" on the "US Fish and Wildlife Environmental Conservation Online System" website.

ecos.fws.gov/speciesProfi...

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I have one question which I did just brief research on. According to Wikipedia the AMOY is listed as LC (Least Concern, the bottomost categorization of status). Wikipedia also goes on to say that the AMOY is NOT protected under the ESA.
Is this correct? Isn't this the chick that now is causing the point to be closed?

I'm not looking for an argument, but wondered if the above info is true, then why is the point closed? Is there other information that negates this, or makes it invalid, or incorrect?

Nor is it listed from this site either (drilled down to Dare County)

www.fws.gov/raleigh/speci...

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Finally found it here (download "Protected Wildlife Species of North Carolina") ...

www.ncwildlife.org/Conser...

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As for myself I think the meetings gave everyone an opportunity to discuss their thoughts on ORV management at CHNS and the items up for discussion by the NPS.

For once, I cannot disagree with you - except for one note - this is not about "ORV management." This is and always has been about fair, open and equal access for ALL to our public lands while maintaining reasonable protection.

I enjoyed the opportunity to discuss and comment. The post-meeting discussions were also productive.

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It is one the State's list of birds of concern. The NPS defers to that list, however, does not use the state recommendation for smaller buffers.
This scoping was in regards to beach access hours, beach access seasons, permit fees and duration structure, vfas, improved accesses.
It was, like other meetings conducted by Super Hallac, well organized, but in the case of the KDH meeting, poorly attended. The majority of attendees at the KDH meeting were NPS employees and NCBBA members. I didn't count the number but I don't think it reached 30.

Don't u mean Kitty Hawk not town beautiful KDH?

Some of the same ole stuff like complaining about a pic with orv use and wanting it "like it used to be". Time for moving on.

One comment that NPS opens ramp one for South Nags Head beach use had me baffled. That beach area will not suport orv use.

The suggestion that orv use at CHNS begin at 6:30 vs 7 has little merit due to sea turtle nesting.

Everyone was given the opportunity to comment although the comments oft strayed from the issues the NPS wanted discussion on.

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As for myself I think the meetings gave everyone an opportunity to discuss their thoughts on ORV management at CHNS and the items up for discussion by the NPS.

For once, I cannot disagree with you - except for one note - this is not about "ORV management." This is and always has been about fair, open and equal access for ALL to our public lands while maintaining reasonable protection.

I enjoyed the opportunity to discuss and comment. The post-meeting discussions were also productive.

Sure it was about orv management ... I do not recall little else being discussed except on how good the cookies tasted.

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As for myself I think the meetings gave everyone an opportunity to discuss their thoughts on ORV management at CHNS and the items up for discussion by the NPS.

For once, I cannot disagree with you - except for one note - this is not about "ORV management." This is and always has been about fair, open and equal access for ALL to our public lands while maintaining reasonable protection.

I enjoyed the opportunity to discuss and comment. The post-meeting discussions were also productive.

Sure it was about orv management ... I do not recall little else being discussed except on how good the cookies tasted.

You should have stayed after and enjoyed the informal conversations! You are welcome to your opinions, and we are thankfully free to express them in the form of public comments.

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The suggestion that orv use at CHNS begin at 6:30 vs 7 has little merit due to sea turtle nesting.




Not sure what this means, do turtles on Hatteras wait until 0630 to lay eggs and finish @ 0700 ???

To me the beaches could open at first light (half hour before sunrise) as long as the Rangers are the first one on the beach to look for turtle crawls, etc. then everyone else could hit the beach to take sunrise photos, shell hunt, fish, etc.

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If the ORVs followed the technicians on to the beach there would be no issue with the turtles. First light makes sense .... even these old eyes can spot the occasional snake in the grass at first light.
If the tech used a simple red/green flag system at the ramp entrance folks would know what is going on and fishermen MAY have a shot at the second most productive part of the day.

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If the ORVs followed the technicians on to the beach there would be no issue with the turtles. First light makes sense .... even these old eyes can spot the occasional snake in the grass at first light.
If the tech used a simple red/green flag system at the ramp entrance folks would know what is going on and fishermen MAY have a shot at the second most productive part of the day.

That makes sense to me and they should start at Cape Point,

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