Is it Greedflation?

RE: Is it Greedflation?





Just need to figure out how to get these users to post. Bring the OBC back to life. I know politics and attacks drive people away. Wish others would see that and stop. Actual moderation would probably go a long way...

J4yDubs


I'm a careful poster nowadays - and you stated my exact reasons. Let's see how this goes...

To the content of this thread: I have been coming to the Outer Banks for over 30 years. On our first trip we stayed in a sound side 5 bedroom that we crammed eight adults and four kids into. It was lived in, comfortable and had very few amenities - and it was a palace to us. In four days, a group of 12 of us are headed to Avon, the same town we stayed in all those years ago. 6 of us (my parents, brothers and two friends) will be in a five bedroom oceanfront that most would consider a Hatteras Island "classic", while another 6 (myself, The Husband and our adult children plus two dogs) will be in another 5 bedroom five-ish houses away that is "tricked out". Each of the houses is easily triple what my parents and their friends paid for that first house with the same amount of people - but time has passed, the value of a dollar has changed, our income has increased and our wants and needs have morphed.

The Husband and I consider a wide variety of homes all up and down the Banks each time we come down and we prioritize what is important to us. Sometimes that means we come down having spent under a grand total while other trips we pay 4k plus for just the house - it all depends on the group we're traveling with, the amount we're willing to spend, what perks we want and what we want our experience to be like for that particular trip. Yes, some of the prices for some of the homes are "crazy" - but we don't HAVE to rent those houses if we don't want to as there are always other options. And yes, some owners, and/or PMs, are going to be greedy but at the same time, other houses are going to justifiably demand a king's ransom for a week's rental - and it's all dependent on perspective.

Did some owners and PMs take advantage of the pandemic and crank up prices? Yes. Is that unique to the OBX rental market? No. Will the market adjust - and eventually force those that were just flat out greedy to dial down their prices? Maybe. Do we pay more for rental houses on the Outer Banks now than we used to? Yes. Are most of us still going to come back to our happy place despite it? Yes. Is it fair to judge those who decide to vacation elsewhere to suit their budgets, tastes and principles? No. Is all of this worth the rise in blood pressure that screaming into the void inevitably causes? Not in my opinion... I mean, feel free to do so - but I'm not going to get het up about it.

Tl;dr: My 2¢ on this is if you don't like the price that is being charged for a particular home you should rent another house... and if your "perfect" rental is too expensive you have options - either save up your vacation dollars or adjust your expectations, and vacation, to fit your budget.


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RE: Is it Greedflation?




Before everyone wants to go burning owners at the stake might want to take a deep breath and kindly ask yourself who is raising your rental prices.
Yes if your home owner changed hands in the last 5 years their price went up because the $225K beach house that had a mortgage payment of $1950 dollars now sold for $550K and now has a mortgage of $2710.

Everyone likes beach nourishment. Nobody realizes that Dare county taxes those homes in the nourishment area(s) an additional tax for that. ( approximately 10 million dollars a mile)

Insurance... Dare, Hyde and Currituck have had a 9.8 percent increase every year since 2019 except 2020.

Utilities, CHEC rates have gone up residential rates: First 1,000 kWh/month 11.67¢/kWh kWh
over 1,000kWh/month 16.92¢/kWh

Price of anything from cleaning supplies to a deck board have gone through the roof....Want a contractor to do work at your house?....
1 good luck finding one
2 when you do you will pay about $100 a hr for a skilled tradesman.
With that said the rental companies are now charging ridiculous fees for their services. used to be a 11-17% cost that rental companies charged the owners for the rental then after that all the fees for cleaning hot tub linens came out from the OWNERS side as well. Those fees still exist. but are much greater.
Example propane on the grill is out renter call the management company and boom you get a new propane tank that day.... Next month the owner gets billed $46 for the tank and $50 for the service call from VACASA for that tank the renter just asked for. ( 2022 rates,...they went up since then)
Hot tub service is now $50-60 a week. That's not counting any electricity water or maintenance issues.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




It's very easy to call it "greedflation" when you aren't the one taking the risk of purchasing, maintaining and renting out a beach vacation house. Until you are an owner you have no idea of the amount of money it takes. Why don't you try it out sometime and see if your opinion changes? Wink smiley

ShadesofSummer


This is so true. The vast majority of home owners here don't make a profit each year on the rental house, so they raise rates so they won't loose as much, it's pretty much that simple.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




The vast majority of home owners here don't make a profit each year on the rental house

Tim-OBX


This is absolutely correct! It has been pointed out here previously that if you have a mortgage, it is very difficult to turn a profit. Owners rationalize that by thinking that if the rent equals or exceeds operating expenses, they have a profit. That's wishful thinking.

That's the reason that from time to time veterans of the board will advise potential rental homeowners that, "If you can't pay the mortgage without the rental income, maybe you shouldn't buy a rental property!"

It's also worth saying that if rental property owners are being honest with their tax reporting, they can't come down to their homes more than 14 days a year to vacation. They can come down to do maintenance, but one of them, or the combination of all the visitors, must do 8 hours of work each day, or the day counts as vacation. Family members using the owners' house? If they don't do 8 hours of work, they count as vacationing owners. That matters when the owner calculates how much of the house expenses are tax deductible.

The way you get rental home-owning to pay off is to hold the property for a long time, maybe until your mortgage is paid off, and take a gain on the sale. Or keep the house as your permanent residence.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




Extremely fortunate to have 2 townhouses in the family since the late '80s. In that time we have seen the highs and lows, people scrambling to buy units, and then the crash with bank owned at times. This past cycle units have been on the market for 2 to 5 days max and getting prices four to five times what was paid in the 80s. Our high season I believe is in the range of $2200 a week, two bedroom sleep six across from Beach. Now I see 34 units on VRBO ranging from 3 to $1,200, yes $1,200 a night from the new owners. Again, extremely fortunate to be looking back at over 30 plus years of ownership.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




"Example propane on the grill is out renter call the management company and boom you get a new propane tank that day.... Next month the owner gets billed $46 for the tank and $50 for the service call from VACASA for that tank the renter just asked for. ( 2022 rates,...they went up since then)"

I'm curious. Does a $5k or $10k/week rental come with a full propane tank on the turnover day? I'm talking about a 20# tank on the grill, not the big tank that fuels the kitchen stove, etc.

My wife still wants to own a cottage at the beach and as we continue to look I'm still finding more and more ways to pay fees to a management company.
I think we will buy a place outright and skip the rental program.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




Im paying double for what I was paying for a Florida condo. I dont want the seaweed with a four year old child who loves the beach. The craziest part for me is our modest obx condo is right beside a 5000/night mc mansion sharing the same beach with a public access beside us 2. its the same beach. I looked at the photos which are nice but its the same beach.


RE: Is it Greedflation?





I think we will buy a place outright and skip the rental program.

johnbt


Yes, do that if you are able. Best choice we ever made was to get out of the rental program.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




Someone mentioned renters from the 60s and 70s.

Yes its disgraceful what this market has done to the outer banks. And that was way before the lingo of "OBX". I wish I could take you all back in time when vacations were the beach and not the house. Although as always I loved those little cottages.



RE: Is it Greedflation?




on a funny note, my much older sister didnt know that rentals nowadays are usually key code access. She goes on cruises and before that Oak Island. She stopped the outer banks I think by the 1980s because it was getting too commercialized. lol Well she said remember when dad and her husband had to get in the realty parking lot way before 5 pm for a space as we all waited in hot cars for a key. I said you dont even need to go to the office any more. She was shocked. That parking lot routine was after Kay Gene Cottages were gone in Kitty Hawk. My sister remembers other cottage courts when I was little that are long gone. everything is on home movies and slides.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




Shortly after I started seeing the oval OBX stickers on the back of vehicles I ran across a takeoff. I was walking to lunch one day in downtown Richmond and passed a parked SUV with an OBX sticker on the back window. I was looking at the vehicle model and checking to see if the hitch had seen any use when I realized it was NOT an OBX sticker.

It looked like an OBX sticker, but it said BOX.
Underneath the big BOX there were tiny little black letters. "WHAT SHOES COME IN"


RE: Is it Greedflation?






It looked like an OBX sticker, but it said BOX.
Underneath the big BOX there were tiny little black letters. "WHAT SHOES COME IN"

johnbt


no clue what the "shoes come in" print was but BOX is a "sticker" for a nutty Massachusetts bar.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




Im paying double for what I was paying for a Florida condo. I dont want the seaweed with a four year old child who loves the beach. The craziest part for me is our modest obx condo is right beside a 5000/night mc mansion sharing the same beach with a public access beside us 2. its the same beach. I looked at the photos which are nice but its the same beach.

jfalba


Florida is having a huge softening of the market between the the socio political climate and women being actively advised by the healthcare providers against vacationing there. As everyone can imagine, between Disney/Orlando and other attractions in FL, that's a significant portion of the typical customer base.

It will be interesting to see if we keep seeing suppressed occupancy and ADR in that market, whether it worsens, or whether that triggers another round of sales converting from rentals to private second homes.


RE: Is it Greedflation?





Some people might not want the interior Pennsylvania crowd "down here". Sad smiley

kinakeeter

Laughing smiley Interior Pennsylvania. Ok...

J4yDubs


They are infesting the Delaware beaches! We can send them down your way.

Bill


What the heck are yoons tock'in abot?

Click to follow link...


RE: Is it Greedflation?





Some people might not want the interior Pennsylvania crowd "down here". Sad smiley

kinakeeter

Laughing smiley Interior Pennsylvania. Ok...

J4yDubs


They are infesting the Delaware beaches! We can send them down your way.

Bill


What the heck are yoons tock'in abot?

Click to follow link...

Beach Farmer


The Pennsylvania Polka is an institution in the Anthracite hard coal region of NE Pennsylvania. If you've ever been to a wedding or a fireman's convention in the coal region, you know what I'm talking about. If you haven't, too bad for you. Terrific people.




RE: Is it Greedflation?




Wow. Surprised by the number of likes the first posts is getting. I guess it's pushed a little too far. Unfortunately, there are still people willing to pay the increases. Some of them are from the north where the Outer Banks prices are actually lower than they are used to. I really hate to stereotype, but I can't help it here. I don't want the jersey shore crowd down here. Sad smiley

J4yDubs


Some people might not want the interior Pennsylvania crowd "down here". Sad smiley

kinakeeter


They correct term for the region is Pennsyltucky. Good folk.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




I suppose this is on topic because it is about inflation. But is anyone old enough to remember when soft drinks went up from 5 cents to 6 cents? I was about seven or eight years old when this happened. The mind blowing thing about it is that they actually modified the existing vending machines to accommodate the rise in price. They did the same thing when the price was raised to 7 cents. But I never saw a modified machine again after that, and from there on price increases were incremented by 5. My father told me that soft drinks were a nickel throughout his boyhood.

Click to follow link...




RE: Is it Greedflation?





Some people might not want the interior Pennsylvania crowd "down here". Sad smiley

kinakeeter

Laughing smiley Interior Pennsylvania. Ok...

J4yDubs


They are infesting the Delaware beaches! We can send them down your way.

Bill


What the heck are yoons tock'in abot?

Click to follow link...

Beach Farmer


The Pennsylvania Polka is an institution in the Anthracite hard coal region of NE Pennsylvania. If you've ever been to a wedding or a fireman's convention in the coal region, you know what I'm talking about. If you haven't, too bad for you. Terrific people.

tc08105


I'm a 2nd Gen AOH member from NE PA...an institution founded by Irish coal crackers from NE PA. I been to just about every Ukrainian and Irish Fire company in NE PA. That's why I posted it. My Uncle was Carl Stroehmann -AKA Grandpa Stroehmann?? He was very fond of it.


RE: Is it Greedflation?





This could be some kind of record!

Squid Pro Quo

At 102 now. Kinda weird.




RE: Is it Greedflation?






Click to follow link...


RE: Is it Greedflation?




I was married in Shamokin Pa and had our wedding in the Elks club, great area back in the day !


RE: Is it Greedflation?




"But is anyone old enough to remember when soft drinks went up from 5 cents to 6 cents? "

Sure. And I was working at McDonalds when a hamburger went from 15 cents to 18.

I don't remember the year, but there was place with a cigarette machine that had good prices. At one point they were undercutting the competition by selling a pack of Marlboros for 33 cents instead of 35 or 40.
You had to put 35 cents into the machine to get a pack, but every pack had two pennies taped to it.

Now there's a seller trying help the customer, if only a little. Sometimes it's the thought that counts.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




"no clue what the "shoes come in" print was"

Shoe box. A lovely sight to someone who loves shoes more than the OBX. A shoe lover testifying with a window sticker.

BOX, what shoes come in.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




"Example propane on the grill is out renter call the management company and boom you get a new propane tank that day.... Next month the owner gets billed $46 for the tank and $50 for the service call from VACASA for that tank the renter just asked for. ( 2022 rates,...they went up since then)"

I'm curious. Does a $5k or $10k/week rental come with a full propane tank on the turnover day? I'm talking about a 20# tank on the grill, not the big tank that fuels the kitchen stove, etc.

My wife still wants to own a cottage at the beach and as we continue to look I'm still finding more and more ways to pay fees to a management company.
I think we will buy a place outright and skip the rental program.

johnbt

No it is never checked by the rental company on turn over. They change it when the renter calls to say it is empty.


RE: Is it Greedflation?




To add insult to injury, the PM's probably just use the nearest propane-tank-in-a-cage setup. Those tanks are only filled 75% full.


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